Wealthy AF Podcast
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Wealthy AF Podcast
Building a 50-Year Legacy: The Gold Standard of Kitchen Design with Brian Foreman
What does it take to build a 50-year legacy in a competitive industry? Brian Foreman, founder and president of Performance Kitchens and Home, reveals his extraordinary journey from determined young carpenter to established kitchen design visionary in this captivating conversation that bridges craftsmanship with entrepreneurship.
When Brian couldn't afford prime real estate for his showroom, he secured an SBA loan to purchase a three-story building for just $40,000—a property now worth exponentially more. His persistence and commitment to excellence allowed him to revolutionize kitchen design presentations in 1980 by building intricate miniature models of every cabinet and appliance when computer design didn't exist. "In every couple, there's one who can visualize and one who cannot," Brian explains, sharing how his innovation reduced presentation times from 12 hours to 45 minutes while dramatically increasing conversions.
What truly sets Brian apart is his methodical "Gold Standard" approach to kitchen design, symbolized by a diamond within a circle. The diamond represents four essential elements that must be approached in sequence: architectural design (how the kitchen relates to the home), cabinetry layout, interior design (where most designers mistakenly begin), and lighting design. This system guarantees kitchens that not only look stunning but function perfectly and maximize property values—crucial knowledge for real estate investors seeking maximum returns.
Beyond technical expertise, Brian shares remarkable stories of mentorship, including his relationship with legendary furniture designer George Nakashima, for whom he sourced and cut walnut that would later become dining tables worth $30,000-$60,000. His cross-disciplinary learning approach highlights how entrepreneurs in any field can achieve extraordinary results by combining specialized knowledge with artistic sensibility and relentless pursuit of excellence.
Ready to transform your kitchen or investment property with design that guarantees maximum value? Connect with Brian and his team at performancekitchens.com or 215-482-0700 to experience the difference that 50 years of passion and innovation can make.
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Welcome to the Wealthy AF podcast, where we dive into what it takes to build real wealth and develop a powerful mindset, while exploring the entrepreneurial journeys of those who've made their mark in the world. I'm your host, martin Perdomo, and today we're excited to welcome a guest who truly embodies excellence and innovation in his field. Excellence and innovation in his field. Today we're joined by Brian Foreman, the founder and president of Performance Kitchens and Home. With over 50 years in business, guys, there's a lot of wisdom here.
Speaker 1:Brian has been transforming homes in the East Coast with luxurious, high-performance kitchen designs, not only in the East Coast but worldwide, and he has some stories he'll share with that in a moment, with you guys. His company is known as the gold standard in kitchen design, and today we'll be discussing how his journey began, how he built a lasting legacy, and how design and craftsmanship intersect with entrepreneurship and wealth building. Brian, welcome to the show. Sir, it's my pleasure to have you and, by the way, thank you for being a sponsor of the upcoming Wealthy AF event meetup in the Allentown area. Sir, welcome to the show.
Speaker 2:Well, thank you very much. I'm happy to be participating. I've always had ties with the real estate industry. I've been an investor myself, and when I really only had a minimum amount of money in the bank, I scrounged enough money with a loan from the SBA to buy my three-story showroom for $40,000, which is now worth quite a bit more. And the importance of owning where I work was always important to me and I've constantly been investing in my little town to bring it up and also to build the business.
Speaker 1:Well, let's start there. Tell us about, I mean, 50 years in business is a very long time, right, I mean self-made, it's a really big accomplishment and I want to know that story. Tell me that story. How do you go from, I mean, being a leader in your field? You know, having professors from Wharton calling you from Japan to go design their kitchens. Tell us that story. How did Brian become such an excellent leader in his field?
Speaker 2:Well, you're taking me down memory lane and I'm blessed that most of those memories are good memories. So I have to share a couple of philosophies that have guided me a long way, and one is the harder you work, the luckier you get. So a lot of times, honestly, I just didn't know what I was doing, but my heart was good and my intentions were good and my perseverance and indomitable spirit pushed me through to be able to be successful, even when the odds might have been stacked against me. Even if it was a mess, I would want to have it as my piece of real estate that I would then rent to the appropriate corporation. And the showroom was built at a time when I, interestingly, was a little bit of a wild kid in high school and I didn't think I was going to college.
Speaker 2:And I somehow turned around after a lot of menial jobs and got into college and then transferred to Boston College, a very good college, then transferred to Boston College, a very good college and at that time I was pretty much focused on architectural design and I had always been a carpenter. I kind of made money for myself by when the other kids were taking summer vacations and stuff. I was picking up work and even when there was no work, I would go onto a job site and say to the foreman was no work? I would go onto a job site and say to the foreman, hey, I need some work for a month, but we don't need any when we're not hiring. I said, well, those two guys aren't doing too much up there. How about I come on and if I can't outwork them, you just fire me and don't even pay me? And they just thought I was crazy.
Speaker 2:And then the next day they didn't tell me to leave and I had a month worth of work and I kind of took that attitude through life and some people really embraced it and I was blessed to learn the value of mentorship by having people who believed in me and in some of my less than orthodox ways of doing things. But, as I said, the perseverance and indomitable spirit and the love of what you do, as I'm sure many people have heard that if you love what you do, you never really work a day in your life, and so I've kind of always believed in that. Have I gone off topic yet? No, no, no, no.
Speaker 1:You're good. You're good. So you've been in the kitchen design business for over 50 years, Brian, starting long before it became a trendy industry.
Speaker 2:Before there was a kitchen business.
Speaker 1:Yes.
Speaker 2:Yes, so there was no Home Depot design, right, there was no.
Speaker 1:Home Depot design. What mindset and entrepreneurial strategies helped you build and sustain a business that has stood the test of time? Because how were you doing it back then? You were just drawing it with doing it back then you were just drawing it with your hands, like you were free, drawing it like you know I actually and I wish I had it now.
Speaker 2:I've been looking all over the internet for anything even closely read. I actually built every little cabinet, every wall cabinet cabinet, every appliance, every furnishing in miniature and put up artificial walls before there were computers, built it on a work table in front of the client and then photographed it with a Polaroid instant, and that was the contract.
Speaker 1:Wow, what year was that what?
Speaker 2:year was that, were? You was that?
Speaker 1:What year was that? Were you doing that?
Speaker 2:What year was that? 1980.
Speaker 1:1980. Whoa, that is how long did something like that take you? What three hours, four hours to do, how long did that take.
Speaker 2:Well, I built it over a couple weeks. It was quite a decorative little piece, but the presentations went from 6, 8, 12 hours down to 45 minutes. Because I learned, in every couple there's one who can visualize and one who cannot. The question is getting them to agree on which one that is, and, by me submitting a visual which allowed them to capitalize on their strengths and play down their weaknesses, didn't have to admit to the other one that they didn't know what the heck I was talking about.
Speaker 1:Here it is. I got to ask Brian, as a businessman, businessman to businessman what difference did that make in your margins early on? I mean, you stood you probably stood head and shoulders above everyone else as it pertains to to um, to presentation, but also your margins must have been extremely healthy because I gotta tell you, you come to my home, um to me and my wife, and you present me something like that. Holy crap, am I impressed? Am I impressed? I was shocked.
Speaker 2:What made it a little better was I was the first one who didn't treat himself as a home improvement contractor and would not enter somebody's home without being invited and being respected and actually hired. So therefore, I converted the first floor of a 100-year-old turkey ranch into an office and had an adjoining barn where I actually built the cabinets for the company and I would invite people to show them the shop. The shop was heated by the remnants of the production of the wood with sawdust, and it was also done by logs that I had created. I was the inventor of the original door flame log you know that they use in the fireplaces and I have several patents actually hardware patents, wow yeah.
Speaker 1:Pretty brilliant guy, sir. You're a pretty brilliant man, that's for sure.
Speaker 2:I don't know about the brilliance, but I'm pretty stubborn and when I get an idea I try to make it practical. And I don't always make the money. The motivation I really the challenge of overcoming obstacles. I don't know why I like it so much, but I do, to this day when something is, someone says well, you can't do it that way, I, I don't challenge them, I just think and think and think until all of a sudden I go well, why not? Here's a way and here's another way. And I've used that in my presentations. I never show people one concept and then say this is what you should do, it's fabulous, it's fabulous. No, I show them three, at least three different concepts and then discuss the merits of each, making sure that not only are their immediate needs satisfied, but that the concept in fruition would actually add value to the home, to the investors out there, maybe the luxury developers that listen to us, maybe the homeowners that listen to us.
Speaker 1:We recently sold our house in Pennsylvania, my wife and I and we were very strategic and I'll share the story with you. When we were remodeling, we had in 2021, we had a big storm over there in Pennsylvania. I don't know if you remember a lot of water in September. My basement got flooded, my sump pumps failed. I had to replace the walls, all of the basement, because my basement got flooded, so I had to replace all of the sheetrock. So at that point I decided to remodel the whole basement. And, of course, while I was remodeling the whole basement, my wife was like why don't we remodel the kitchen? And then why don't we remodel the bathroom? Why don't we put new floors? So I wind up pretty much remodeling the whole house.
Speaker 1:But we were strategic in remodeling the house, specifically remodeling the kitchen, because we knew that the kitchen is what would sell the house. And my wife had an idea that she was going to sell it for a number and I was like there's no way in the world you're going to sell it for this number. And she said, absolutely I will because of my kitchen and what I've done to my home and the kitchen. Sure enough, she was a realtor. The kitchen sold the house. There was no numbers, there were no comps in the market to justify it, but she sold it at a pretty high price compared to what everything else was selling and we believe part of that was the kitchen. So I want you to speak to the investors and the homeowners that might want to sell their house. In your opinion, how does a high quality design impact of a kitchen impact the property value and play into a real estate? You know investment success.
Speaker 2:First of all, I want to thank you for giving me the platform to discuss exactly what you're talking about. I've had this issue. I mean it from the bottom of my soul. It's something that people don't realize that if you can associate with the right type of people with the right experience and target what's most important, it may cost you a little bit more on the front end but, as your wife proved, it comes back at the end. Gold standard to performance, kitchens that I've painstakingly developed that you can't expect anyone to hit on all these points. It took me at least 35 years to even know what I was doing.
Speaker 2:So people get into a business. They've been doing it for seven years, 11 years. What they're really doing is a glorified decorating exercise. They're not looking at the bones of the property and saying was this house built originally as a left-hand driveway but they couldn't fit it on the lot, so they flipped the kitchen and put it over here? Look at the ingress-ingress to the perishables versus the non-perishables that go in the pantry. The traffic flow is not good and it's not feeling like the core of the house. Instead, the way they look at it is my cabinets are old, my floor is dirty. I need new stuff in here. Well, you're going to spend the same amount of money if you put new stuff in your old kitchen than if you make little tweaks that improve the layout. And I don't make terribly public until I deal with my clients because I tell them and it's very, very obvious they won't know exactly why their kitchen looks better than their neighbor's gold standard in kitchen design. You will see things like, instead of having an appliance that's 24 inches wide, like a dishwasher, and a range that's 30 inches, like a range is, or 36, and the accompanying wall cabinet above it following suit, with two 12-inch doors to go over the 24-inch dishwasher and two 18-inch to go over the 36-inch range, now you have three, two, three, four different sized wall cabinets.
Speaker 2:Well, man is not built that way. His eyes it's a predator. They're on the side. He doesn't look up and down, like the architects are taught at school. He looks across, and the visual plane of wall cabinets and the symmetry of the doors is what makes a small space look expansive. You see the intensity and the love and passion for this that we have. It's not about selling stuff. I don't care if we make less money. I don't care. What I care is that people say if you go anywhere else, you're crazy, you're wasting your time. You're wasting your time, you're wasting your money Because we cross the T's and dot the I's in the beginning so that you don't have extended build time, incomplete plans, cost overruns, all that nonsense which is a typical headache in a kitchen renovation.
Speaker 1:I mean true expert speaking here, and I can feel your passion. I can see it in your eyes. I can see that you know what you're talking about and it just shines through in your words and through your soul. How do you keep innovating and evolving, and what advice would you give to entrepreneurs about staying relevant, as you've done over the course of 50 years?
Speaker 2:your questions are. You know they make you think um, most of the things that you ask me have been instinctual, so for me to verbalize them, it gives me the same sense of reward as it does when I teach the design students at Drexel or Jefferson or Harcum how to focus and to personalize the space yet add value to something that's going to be there a lot longer than the person who initially hired you to do it. So to stay relevant, you have to kind of go to basics, and to me a lot of it is the return on the investment, Because if you're investing good money in something that's going to look dated, that could just mean a decorative idea, but it could also have to do with the layout of the kitchen. Sometimes an encapsulating U-shaped kitchen could be improved with a peninsula that had seating. When the kids were young you could just throw a sandwich at them, but as you got older it could actually be turned into a bar.
Speaker 2:One of the things that we do that I do not believe is done by anyone else that I've ever heard. I know it's not taught National Kitchen and Bath Association. I was a founding member of that. I know it's not part of the American Institute of Architecture, because I went to school for architecture and they never taught me anything about this stuff and I know it's not in the books that I've read or the ones that I've written, because I really don't want to make all my knowledge publicly out there, except for closed audiences like what we have here out there, except for closed audiences like what we have here. That I love. But to just get out there and to bring average to imply that it's better is not really my mission statement.
Speaker 2:It's very difficult to carry this on and keep it relevant, because everyone wants new and everybody wants to follow trends. For example, there's a door that they call the shaker door. Well, if you know anything about shaker cabinetry, you know that the shakers were a small group of and seen how they did their joinery way before I even committed to being focused on kitchens. At that time I was exhibiting with the Pennsylvania Guild of Craftsmen and went to places, small venues like the Walnut Street Gallery, and I did one-of of a kind type art pieces. So when you tell me I want a shaker style, to me you have no idea what a shaker style is, but I understand it's the trend to have a simplistic framed door that looks like it could go with any style. But when you realize that the construction of that shaker door could be done with a veneered frame, or it could be done with a hardwood, or it could be done with a substrate that is composed of something other than wood it could be compressed sawdust and resin.
Speaker 2:It could be all different ways to do it and there's advantages and disadvantages to both. You can't just make blanket statements that I don't want medium density fiberboard in my kitchen because it gets carcinogen, and you can't just make those statements because the off gassing is different. I know that I've worked in there, I've had my eyes tear from the different shops and I know by my eye-tear meter how much gas is coming into that room and how dangerous it is. So if I live in a shore house with a high humidity content somewhere in the 11% to 14% range, which I always carried my moisture meter to check well then why would I put in an unstable product just because it was popular and it had the same name as a culture from the 1800s? It's craziness. It's like this. I'm good at a lot of things. I'm really bad at insurance. I don't get it.
Speaker 2:You pay all this money. You have a problem. You don't get paid, you don't get paid, I don't get it. So what I do? I go to an expert and I say I don't want to deal with a company, I want an agent. I want you to guide me, just like when you try to find a really good realtor and you let them guide you through the process. I have one of the best realtors in the business Wow.
Speaker 1:You might know her. That's important. Yeah, I know.
Speaker 2:That's very important. That's very, very important, and it's funny how, like personalities like that attract, like you and I, the passion that we obviously both have for what we're doing. It's if you let that energy bloom. Um, I think that's part of of of of letting the, allowing the legacy to continue, instead of forcing it and saying I know that this is better. Well, guess what? It's not better for everyone all the time, and you know we have various degrees of quality, but our top quality things are things that the average person they're not even aware of. I'm not sure.
Speaker 1:I get that most people aren't, are not even you know, they don't know about the moisture density and all of these things you're talking about, which you said something you hit on that's really important early on and you said I don't, I'm not good at insurance. I'm good at a lot of things, but I'm not good at insurance. So I go to an insurance agent to help me with insurance. Right, I'm not good at selling, I'm not good at insurance. I'm good at a lot of things, but I'm not good at insurance. So I go to an insurance agent to help me with insurance. I'm not good at selling. I'm not good at selling my realtor, so I go to my pro. I sell in real estate. I can redevelopment, but hey, I got my people that sell them for me. I got a property management, but I got an expert that manages my properties.
Speaker 1:So you hit on that, which leads on to mentorship and early on the discussion you said you had great mentors and here in this podcast we believe in mentorship. We have a community, we have a private community where I mentor people and I teach people and I coach them on mindset and I coach them on how to get their first deal and how to create wealth through real estate investing. In fact, mindset and I coach them on how to get their first deal and how to create wealth through real estate investing. In fact, that event that you guys sponsored, that Design Kitchen sponsored, is exactly that how to become. We're going to be talking about how to become financially free in under three years through real estate investing. By the way, if you guys, if you're listening or watching this, make sure you go to wealthyafai register. Design Kitchen, performance Kitchen is the sponsor of that. But mentorship I want to talk about mentorship. Mentorship has clearly been a significant part of your life. Please talk about that. How did your mentors shape your journey? Because we can't do this without mentors.
Speaker 2:I have had mentors.
Speaker 1:I still have mentors. Please tell us on that.
Speaker 2:Well, that's one of my favorite topics but if you wouldn't mind, I just want to digress a little bit to something that I might have misled or not been real clear on the importance of having a professional lay your house floor plan out, as opposed to the realtor or the contractor or someone who says they're a kitchen expert doing that. It's a hard thing for people to let go of. It doesn't cost a lot of money, but you can get a lot more for that real estate without having to put the most expensive cabinetry in there. We have very modest. We don't sell things that are junk or service issues and all of our cabinetry even our lower price has a baked top coat which is a conversion varnish accelerated by heat.
Speaker 2:That's very unusual today. I can talk about that later if you want. But I don't want to get away from your real topic, which is the mentorship. But I didn't want to skip over that part that I left out because it just sounds kind of like well, everybody knows you do a new kitchen, you sell the house for more money. No, it's not that simplistic. If you follow the rules of the gold standard in kitchen design, you are guaranteed to get top dollar for that.
Speaker 1:Oh, I love that.
Speaker 2:You want to move in it yourself. It's so fun.
Speaker 1:Okay, before you answer that mentorship question, give me three of the golden rule standard for top kitchen to guarantee that return on your money.
Speaker 2:Okay, it's very easy. I don't have any visual aids because I'm not looking at this as a sales tool, but the performance logo is comprised of a diamond with a circle around it and the diamond represents the four elements of design in the order that it must be approached. It must be approached architecturally. How does that space in the kitchen relate to the rest of the architecture of the home? It must be looked at in the cabinetry layout. How does that cabinetry specification fit the space that you've dedicated in that architectural design?
Speaker 2:The third part is the interior design, which is where everybody wants to start the process, which is totally inappropriate, and that is the cohesiveness of the dissimilar materials and the decorative items that make up the kitchen. Very important, very personal. Everybody wants to talk about it. But if you don't start with architectural design, move into your cabinetry design and then into your interior design, you cannot enter the fourth element of the design diamond and that is your lighting design. You need to have a combination of peripheral lighting, task lighting and decorative lighting so that you're not following shadows of yourself around To constantly be saying I need more windows or my kitchen's dark or whatever just says you have an inappropriate lighting plan. Number one and number two. You're not aware that you're not only in your kitchen in the daytime, you're actually in there in the nighttime. So it's very, very important that you pull this all together. And that's what the circle is that goes around the diamond. That circle represents the gold standard of kitchen design in the design management.
Speaker 2:How do you make a design that will be orchestrated so that it's done with the intention that it was designed? How many times do you hear well, the carpenter just cut that filler down and moved it over, and now it doesn't work down here. It says right on our plans, in a big plan, with a saw blade, with a line going through it, no changes, called performance. They may not think of all the intricacies or the domino effect of changing one little thing. They may have decided to pack out a wall to get rid of a pipe chase and not realize that it pushed their minimal space between their opposing counters down to a space that it's not comfortable to have someone sitting in an island and someone walking behind it.
Speaker 2:This is all part of that extra little special gold standard of design. This is what maybe someday I'll write a book about when I feel like. But I learned my lesson of of over-educating too soon. People have to like you and what you have and they have to understand the value of your cabinetry. So I feel unfair that I'm not answering. I don't want to, I don't want to, I don't want to um no, this was a great answer.
Speaker 1:I mean, this is one of my main takeaways. This is really good stuff. It's showcasing excellence. What I'm seeing here, what I'm gathering, is showcasing what excellence looks like and part of my. One of my core values is excellence right, Live life with excellence and run my business with excellence.
Speaker 2:Well, you're going to love this. You're going to love this story, then, because this is I do not have the visual, maybe Quinn could pull it up. Maybe you'll tell me it's irrelevant. In my office, in two places there's a placard of dedication and it says something like I'm just paraphrasing fundraising. These are the five mentors who established the DNA of every performance kitchen as far as quality and adding value to the home, something like that. It shows five pictures of five people who I had no idea at the time. I was in the company of legends. I was 20-something years old.
Speaker 2:George Nakashima, the father of modern furniture, was a friend of a friend of mine who was a tree, an arborist, and in my struggle to have diversified income, I worked as a tree arborist and I actually built my own sawmill. I took the walnut, which was George Nakashima's favorite wood, and took a suburban home and leveled the house and built a whole acre of wood just curing so that he could use it. He taught me how to read the grain so that he could take what he called flitches and turn these beautiful slabs of nature into furniture. Now that his dining room tables after his death are worth $30,000 to $60,000. It's beautiful and they are with my wood.
Speaker 2:I cut that wood. It's very. I didn't know at the time, I didn't know that I was one of the few people who was ever even allowed in his shop, let alone supplying him his wood. And it all happened because my friend was a tree cutter and had no artistic inclination whatsoever. And every time I cut a tree I went do you smell that inclination whatsoever? And every time I cut a tree I went do you smell that? Oh my god, do you look at that grain? You thought I was crazy. You just want to cut it up, make it into firewood. You know.
Speaker 1:So this is, um, that was so what impact, what impact did that mentor have on you early on? You're a 26 year old kid and and you're an artist, obviously, obviously, and you have this, you have this passion and this, you know, this drive for excellence. How did that relationship with him have an impact on you and your success today?
Speaker 2:Right, Well, as I said earlier, I was a member of the Pennsylvania Guild of Craftsmen and one of my goals was to build. I was always into repurposing things. I would find an old dining room set of chairs, but the backs were all hand-carved, so I would take all the backs together and alternate the curves one after the other and make something to hang your blanket at the end of your bed or some weird thing that I creation. That you know, only one person saw art in. It was willing to pay.
Speaker 2:Needless to say, I couldn't very well make a living. I was a very happy starving artist. To pay, needless to say, I couldn't very well make a living. I was a very happy starving artist, but somewhere my more materialistic gene and need for responsibility overshadowed it. But you know, I never really lost that thing. And after George Nakashima there were four other. I don't know if you want me to get into them, but they were just as remarkable of people and I'm sure everyone has some connection to one of the five people who helped me become Performance Kitchens at Home and establish the gold standard in kitchen design.
Speaker 1:I love that. Well, thank you so much. We are out of time, brian, thank you so much. I'd love to have you come much. We are out of time, brian, thank you so much. I'd love to have you come back. We're out of time today, but you shared so much wisdom, so excellence just literally shines through your words and I can see it in your spirit, in your eyes. For those that are not watching him, but I'm telling you, I can see the excellence just come out of his eyes. It's just man, he's passionate about this stuff and it's obvious that he knows this stuff. So I want to share with you and the audience just a few other pointers and some of my takeaways here, and there's plenty of them more. But you started with hard work. The harder you work, the luckier you get. Great.
Speaker 2:Absolutely, I believe it.
Speaker 1:Hard work. The harder you work, the luckier you get Great. Absolutely, I believe it Right. You also said you didn't always make money. Your motivation, solving the problem, has always been your motivation. So solving, amen, amen, focus on that, the money will come.
Speaker 1:And the biggest things I got from this one was the following your rules and I don't remember what you called it, but it was, architecturally the diamond and the circle which was following the rules of excellence, I think, is in a kitchen which is architectural design, cabinetry layout, interior design and lighting design. Man, these are things that as a consumer, just a regular consumer, even as a redeveloper, developer, I don't think about. I really am not thinking about these things. I'm looking at, like you said, like everyone else, let's go into the design. We want this here, this there, this there, this here, this there, and voila, it's done right, it looks pretty and it looks good. But, man, you really this is what I'm talking about excellence, you really hiring your company really takes it to another level.
Speaker 1:So, for those investors, or even those that are here listening, and you really want a kitchen done right, man, they got to reach out to you. How do they reach out to you, brian? Where can they find you? What's your to you? How do they reach out to you, brian? Where can they find you? What's your website? How do they call you? Because I'm sure uh, I'll tell you this my next kitchen, brother, you guys are designing for me I assure you that I look forward my next kitchen.
Speaker 1:My next kitchen you guys are designing for me. I'm not going to home depot or or any of these other places. Uh, you guys are designing my next kitchen, so where do people find you? How can they connect with you?
Speaker 2:well, the the easiest thing is, if you forget, like I do, is just to google search. You know, uh kitchens, philadelphia, or the little town that we're in, which is technically still philadelphia. Um is manioc m-a-n-A-Y-U-N-K, and we so kitchensphiladelphiacom.
Speaker 1:is that what we're looking for? What's the website?
Speaker 2:The website is performancekitchenscom.
Speaker 1:Performancekitchenscom. So look up performancekitchenscom, performancekitchenscom. You can look up Brian Foreman, performancekitchenscom, performancekitchenscom. You can look up Brian Foreman, performancekitchenscom, and you can connect. Are your socials all on there, your social media platforms, so people can see the kind of workmanship you?
Speaker 2:guys are doing yeah, and our phone number is real easy to remember. It's 4 times 2 is how I remember it, so it's 482-07 0700, it's pretty easy 482 0700 area code erica 215 215, area code 482 0700 right, okay, perfect, we did.
Speaker 2:You know we have people who've come to us and then they've moved to to colorado or japan and once they go views us, they don't want to go anywhere else, and I drop ship um a tractor trailer a month. So it's not. It doesn't even cost more to do it the right way, so that's not an issue. Don't think you need to buy it from the local lumber yard or something like that. It's's not the case.
Speaker 1:That's amazing. Well, thank you so much, brian. It's been my pleasure, my honor, to have you here, and thank you for sharing all your wisdom and all of your experience. It has been certainly my pleasure, sir. Thank you very, very much.
Speaker 2:And thank you for being so easy to talk to.
Speaker 1:You're welcome. Thank you for coming.
Speaker 2:Thank you.
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